On "big production movies" they are using real guns firing real blanks. No plugged barrels at all.

=============================================
The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.
Joseph Joubert, essayist (1754-1824)

thank you sir! does anyone know if it's illegal to remove the plug from the barrel on a blank gun? I rather just use blanks instead of adding in post, looks more realistic and less time consuming

Xx-JERRYLJAMES-xX
www.youtube.com/jerryljames

In the States it's illegal for anyone (even people on movie sets) to alter a weapon.

Independent Studio Services in Sunland, CA rents a great product called "non guns".
It's essentially a realistic looking cap gun that is designed to flash from the barrel
without anything leaving it.

if you want it to look good in post, you can, it will just be harder work but more importantly, it will be a lot cheaper. one of the big things iv found out about film making is you can do expensive things cheaply, its just much harder work. i think the film industry in general is much to carless with money and a lot of people think you have to spend a lot of money on it to look good, because thats the way its 'meant to be done'. if you are a truly passionate film making you will do the extra work to make it a lot cheaper.

Anyway, the best approach these days is to get a non-firing gun and add muzzle flashes and shell cases in post. It's really very easy for anyone even moderately competent with 3D and compositing software; there was even a video posted a year or so back on a couple of low-budget web sites showing how to do it.

I have fired a number of guns and filmed it. AK-47s. Mauser rifle. 357 magnum. 40 caliber auto. It was really, really rare to catch a muzzle flash on camera. This is one case where movies go for unrealism because the eye catches the muzzle flash even when the camera doesn't.

A real gun should not produce a muzzle flash out of the ejector. If it did that means you are losing power from your shot. You can see the trace of a flash from a revolver because there is a space between the cylinder and the barrel but you had better be concentrating really, really hard to see it.

What you are seeing is what are called suicide guns. If you put an ordinary gun up to your head and fire the blank will kill you from the blast and debris of the blank. A suicide gun is a special blank gun with the barrel plugged so it is safe to put up to an actor's head (or other body part) without any worries. Because the barrel is plugged the blast is forced out elsewhere, usually that is what you are seeing.

So in effect you are trying to emulate a fake gun rather than a real one.

RJSchwarz
San Diego, CA

the cost off using live firing weapons on set is quite high, apart from the renting, you have to have a proffesional present and often police. if you do this without notifying the police and people report bangs of gunfire they will turn up with an armed response team and probably arrest some people, it does happen, it happened to a friend of mine and they arrested the art director.

Of course if you are gonna use real weapons and CGI muzzle blasts you may not even want to bother with blanks at all.

RJSchwarz
San Diego, CA

quote:

---

Originally posted by pond-weed
if you are a truly passionate film making you will do the extra work to make it a lot cheaper.

---

This is quite insulting, pond-weed. To imply that someone like
me, who is willing to spend the money to get the job done quickly
makes me less than truly passionate is not needed.

I respect that you want to save money, do the hard work and get
excellent results. There is no reason why you shouldn't respect
filmmakers like me who is willing to spend the money to make
things look good. That doesn't make me careless with money.

I am just as passionate about making movies as you are. Just because
I am willing to pay a licensed gun professional and a pyrotechnician
to save time on my movies doesn't make me a less passionate filmmaker.

=============================================
The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.
Joseph Joubert, essayist (1754-1824)

sorry how i came accross, i didnt mean to insult you, or stereotype you. i guess we have slightly different aproaches to film making and i guess so does everyone, what ever works for you, good luck.

Slightly different aproaches to making a film is what independent filmmaking
is all about. The more we support each other the better.

A forum like this is a great place to learn from each other. To learn how different
filmmaker aproach the same situation. To get some tips and advice.

And each of us is a truly passionate filmmaker.

A word to the wise, we playing with fake weaponry, you can get hurt. I have a 4 inch gash in my leg form someone who decided the swords were dull enough for actuall combat.
Plus as far as guns firing fake rounds go, I have seen the barrel of a 12 gauge shotgun explode in someones hands. It turns out the only reason it exploded was beacause the barrel was dirty from all the blanks they had fire.

Moral of the story, fake weapons are real weapons treat them as such. Add the flashes in postpro.

And heres a question, do you really want your actors running around with real guns for awhile? I dunno man.....?:p?

That's it! You people have stood in my way long enough! I'm going to clown college!

I would have to agree with pond-weed, on this one, if you are able to import into software such as After Effects in post then you will be able to get very close to what you are after.

This includes, muzzel flash, smoke, fire and also the ability to add in the shells ejecting etc.

Cheers
BR

oh god no i would never put guns in the hands of my actors
hahahaha

"They say a picture is worth a thousand words. But a film? Well, thats worth a thousand pictures."

-(Own3d Studios)-

www.own3dstudios.com