quote:

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Originally posted by Aspiring mogul

... the actors seem to eat real food, but the actors also go through take after take of the same dining scene. I have also seen scenes where the actors cut up a whole cake or a complete steak, so that food item obviously would not be used again.

So I've been wondering, do the actors eat the same piece of cake again and again? And do they use a whole real cake for take after take? It seems like a waste of good food to do that.

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Generally, "Food stylists" are hired as part of the Property Department (Props) on days when there are scenes with a lot of food. They'll set up a "kitchen" space somewhere on stage and keep refreshing the set with fresh food for each take as necessary. It's not always replaced. Only when it will be seen on camera.

Yes, there can be a lot of waste while making a movie because everything is built for a temporary purpose.

Brian Dzyak
Cameraman/Author
IATSE Local 600, SOC
http://www.whatireallywanttodo.com
http://www.realfilmcareer.com

Thanks, Bryan. If the food is used for a shot and can't be used again, why not eat it? Unless it's cooked in a manner that makes the food suitable for filming, but not eating.

If you got the shot in one take that would probably work fine, but with different takes and different angles you can't have the actor eating all day and you don't want the cake getting smaller and larger depending upon the angle of the shot. You can have the actor not put the food in their mouth, just wave the fork around or whatever, or you need to replace the slice of cake each take for consistency sake. Thus the support people bjdzyak mentioned.

RJSchwarz

quote:

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Originally posted by Aspiring mogul

Thanks, Bryan. If the food is used for a shot and can't be used again, why not eat it? Unless it's cooked in a manner that makes the food suitable for filming, but not eating.

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Um, well, in reality, there aren't a lot of scenes with food in them so this doesn't come up very often.

What you may be thinking of are large family dinner-type scenes where the family is huddled around a table stocked with a large turkey and all the trimmings. Food will be refreshed as necessary, but if you notice, you don't see the Actors really eating a whole lot. Scenes like that are mostly shot beginning with someone bringing the last of the dishes to the table while the rest of the characters chatter on loudly. The conversation calms down and eventually a few minutes later, the scene settles into a one-on-one conversation between just two or three of the characters. In all of that, you won't really see many of the Actors actually eating much of anything.

But what happens to the food they DO use on set? It likely does get tossed, most of it anyway. It's been on set for hours in a hot environment. It's not something you necessarily want to eat.

Now, COOKING SHOWS are something else. 🙂 I've done three in my career and there can be great perks after the taping of the show is done. Again, you wouldn't necessarily eat what is shot as food stylists use lots of different techniques to make that food look more scrumptious than it might be. But the cooks backstage usually have extra that the crew is welcome to at wrap. ?8D?

Brian Dzyak
Cameraman/Author
IATSE Local 600, SOC
http://www.whatireallywanttodo.com
http://www.realfilmcareer.com

I'm thinking of a scene from the Longest Day - the German general is thanking everyone for his birthday cake, and he cuts it. Agreed, no one is seen eating that cake, but that cake seems real. So did they get several cakes to do several takes of that 30-second scene?

By the way, I love food, and I'm thinking of offering my crew a good meal at the end of the day, if they volunteer on my film project. I can afford to get a good caterer. 🙂

I suspect they used several cakes for that 30 second scene.

I dated a food stylist for a a year. It's an interesting gig that
very few people are aware of. Brian is right about the left
over and unused food. Usually the production can't stop
as soon as the eating scene is finished to allow the crew
to eat what's left. And to keep the food looking good under
the lights various items are sprayed on it. Almost always
something food grade eatable, but not something that
a crew would be willing to eat several hours after the scene
is shot.

I was on a set where there was this amazing sea food buffet.
It was actually painful for the crew to watch all that crab and
lobster being thrown away at the end of the scene.

I have found that offering a good meal in the middle of the
day (typically at the 6 hour mark) is much better than a meal
at the end of the day. At the end of a 12 hour day, most
people just want to go home. You should also offer a bit of
breakfast at the start of the day. Coffee, tea, juice, bagels,
donuts, muffins.

=============================================
The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.
Joseph Joubert, essayist (1754-1824)

You're right on, CI - the employment standards legislation in most states require a break in the morning and another one in the afternoon, and an hour for lunch. If my crew was to work for 12 hours, they would be entitled to an hour for lunch, and, possibly, an hour for dinner.

That said, I'm thinking of making my indie production a long shot thing - everyone takes a week off work to go off and make this a working vacation, so they would have a different mindset than those who work for the major studios.

quote:

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Originally posted by Aspiring mogul

You're right on, CI - the employment standards legislation in most states require a break in the morning and another one in the afternoon, and an hour for lunch. If my crew was to work for 12 hours, they would be entitled to an hour for lunch, and, possibly, an hour for dinner.

That said, I'm thinking of making my indie production a long shot thing - everyone takes a week off work to go off and make this a working vacation, so they would have a different mindset than those who work for the major studios.

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Most breaks are 6 hours after official calltime. So, if official call is 6am, then a HALF HOUR lunch is mandated for 12pm.

There are caveats to that, though.

First, much of the crew actually has a pre-call of around 18 minutes prior to the official calltime, so technically, those crew are in a "meal penalty" every day which is like a library fine designed to encourage Producers to break the crew on time. For efficiencies sake, they buy those meal penalties because it's more important to bring some people in early to prep for the day before the Director and cast arrives.

Also, while lunch is typically 30 minutes (when a Caterer is providing lunch), it is actually 30 minutes after the last man in line goes through. So, in reality, depending upon the size of the crew, lunch can easily be 45 minutes to an hour even though officially, it is listed as 30 minutes.

Also, while lunch is mandated to be 6 hours after the official calltime, the AD's can call for a "Grace Period" which allows them to finish a setup without incurring meal penalties.

That takes care of the lunch. The beginning of most days, the Caterer is there in the morning and has breakfast items available for the cast and crew. After lunch, the Caterer packs up and goes and the Craft Service department will continue to stock the "snack" table throughout the day. If the day will run very long (up to and past 14 hours or so), Craft Service may also bring in something akin to a second meal, though there is no break and the crew takes a few bites here and there as it continues to work.

Nowhere in there is the on-screen food. That is just considered a prop and is never served to the cast or crew at any time.

Brian Dzyak
Cameraman/Author
IATSE Local 600, SOC
http://www.whatireallywanttodo.com
http://www.realfilmcareer.com

If you cut a cake but didn't eat the slice you could return the slice and seal the slices with frosting or you could cut the cake I one shot and dialogue in a second shot so there is minimal chance of an error in the cake cutting shot.

RJSchwarz

Bryan, who pays the caterer? Does the production company pay, or do the crewmembers pay as individuals?

I am talking about a non union shoot where cast and crew are
volunteering their time. I have found that a meal at the six hour
point is much better than one at the end of the day. People like
to go home immediately after the long day rather than sit down and
have a meal.

Nothing written in stone. You, as the producer, can offer the cast
and crew a meal at the end of the day.

quote:

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Originally posted by Aspiring mogul

Bryan, who pays the caterer? Does the production company pay, or do the crewmembers pay as individuals?

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On union, studio shows, non union independent shows with a budget
and non union shows using a volunteer cast and crew the prodCo
pays for the meals.

=============================================
The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.
Joseph Joubert, essayist (1754-1824)

Good point, CI. I think the best incentive is to offer snacks and meals at all breaks, except the end of the day, when everyone wants to go home. I was thinking that, if everyone went out for the weekend, they would want to get together and have a nice dinner afterwards, to enjoy a good rest. But I guess the work routine just doesn't work like that.

It might be very different where you will be shooting and the
crews you will be using. As you can see, Brian comes from the
union, studio shows with meal penalties and other union rules. I
come from the non union world and very often do what you are
intending to do. A movie made by dedicated amateurs for no pay.

The difference is Im shooting in Los Angeles. Even volunteers
expect some accept of the union guidelines to be followed. I stick
to 12 hour days. I have a 30 minute meal six hours after call
time. That kind of thing. It might be more like a weekend get
together for you and your cast and crew. After a day of this
working vacation, they may prefer to have a nice meal and sit
around and talk about the day.

Here in Los Angeles the cast and crews I have worked with just
want to get home to their families after a 12 hour day on the set.

quote:

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Originally posted by certified instigator

It might be very different where you will be shooting and the
crews you will be using. As you can see, Brian comes from the
union, studio shows with meal penalties and other union rules. I
come from the non union world and very often do what you are
intending to do. A movie made by dedicated amateurs for no pay.

The difference is Im shooting in Los Angeles. Even volunteers
expect some accept of the union guidelines to be followed. I stick
to 12 hour days. I have a 30 minute meal six hours after call
time. That kind of thing. It might be more like a weekend get
together for you and your cast and crew. After a day of this
working vacation, they may prefer to have a nice meal and sit
around and talk about the day.

Here in Los Angeles the cast and crews I have worked with just
want to get home to their families after a 12 hour day on the set.

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Right.

While what I described is what the typical "professionals" have come to expect, I have worked enough low-budget/free jobs to know that there is often no difference. More often than not, nobody is interested in wrapping then sitting around having a really great dinner with people they just spent the last 14 hours with... no offense to them, but at the end of a long day, people really just want to go home.

A Producer's perspective should be on keeping the crew productive THROUGHOUT the day, not trying to figure out how to reward them at the end of it, particularly if they're not being paid well or at all.

As silly as it sounds, food has an amazing effect toward this end. If you want to achieve all the setups you need to do to complete the day's work, it can truly be as simple as keeping a well-stocked Craft Service table ALL DAY LONG and break six hours after crew call for a sit-down lunch when everyone can rest and refresh themselves for the next "half" of the day which will likely go at least another six to eight hours or more.

The point is that to get the product you want, a Producer can't treat the people like they were pieces of expendable equipment. It's simple, particularly if there is low or no pay: just treat everyone on set as if they are doing YOU a favor by being there (because they are), not like you're doing them a favor by offering a crappy paying job. Feed them, say "Thank you!" A LOT! and welcome everyone at the beginning of every day. Learn their names.

It's the little things that go a long way to YOU getting the film YOU want in the can so that YOU can build a better career for yourself. The fact is that you need them more than they need you. Treat them well and the results will be apparent in the footage you take home.

Brian Dzyak
Cameraman/Author
IATSE Local 600, SOC
http://www.whatireallywanttodo.com
http://www.realfilmcareer.com