Have you contacted the record company that has rights to the song? They will tell you what is will cost...based on your useage.
1. Film festivals only
2. National/worldwide release
3. TV/Cable
4. etc.

They will outline each use and the cost for the various areas.

I will be entering the film into festivals, but hope to sell it to a distributor. Is it alright to just get the rights for festival use and then worry about getting other rights if an offer gets made?

It's a catch 22. If you secure festival rights only and then want to go back to them for realease rights they may up the price if they know the potential of your film. Negotiate all pricing up front...but only secure the festival rights up front. Pay as you go kind of contract. They do this business every day so it is a standard daily process for them.

You can do that? I can say that I only want to initially pay for the festival rights but I want to put an ammendment in that I can pay a reasonable amount for rights to distribute too?

If so, thanks for the heads up.

I might not use the word reasonable, but the music industry does this as a major part of their business so they will let you know what each cost will be. You wouldn't want to pay for all the rights upfront... say for theatrical release until it is a reality. You can pay as you go...but the price for a festival may not be astronomical...the price for a theatrical run can be.

You really don't want to get into a position where you pay $500 for the festival rights, then you get a distributor interested and the music company want $100,000 for the theatrical/DVD rights. That's why you want to get the numbers settled before you put the music on the soundtrack for your movie... and they could be anything from $1 to 'not at any price'.

Or, unless you really, really must absolutely have that single music track and no other, get a composer to create original music instead; that's far less hassle and there are plenty of competent composers who'll do a whole movie for less than the cost of buying a single track from a big music company.

?quote??i?I am only looking to possibly get the rights to have a character sing a song in my film, without the master recording actually even playing?/i?

Is your charater just singing a small sample. Then surely the rights are different to the rights if you were actually using the record. I mean fair enough if you have a scene where the character is performing the whole song on stage or in a show for example but if they are only singing casually a few lines. Do you still need to get the same rights?

Mark G is right though if you dont need a paticular song than hire a small local composer. It will cost a fraction of the price and you will also (if they are good) have the added bonus of there services in the future.

Thanks
Rob - UK

There are two types of rights. The rights to use a song (character singing the song in your film) and the rights to use a certain person's performance of that song. The second type is probably more expensive but needless to say the songwriters want/deserve a cut even if you don't use the Rolling Stones version of the song so you have to get and pay for the rights.

RJSchwarz
San Diego, CA

Yes they deserve there share. Was rolling stones the song you are using or was that just you RJSchwarz using an example. If it is the song i am sure there are loads of local bands who have songs just like that. Is there a reason why you cant use a original song?

Thanks
Rob - UK

I made them up as an example. Pulled the name right out of my....

RJSchwarz
San Diego, CA

As rjshwarz stated, there is no specified song at the moment. I feel that this leaves me in the best situation as I will be able to shop around for a song that will work for what I need, yet at the same time not be rediculously expensive.

I already have a couple musicians who I know personally that will attempt of compose some stuff for me to fill in the majority of the music I need (for free none-the-less(gotta love good friends who are dedicated musicians)). But I do need to find a song, which is recognizable to most people, because their will be a person singing it and it needs to be a song, which ia semi-popular, because they will be singing it as if it is something that would be a song that the majority of the people in attendance would know.

I will probably have to wait until I cast the character who will be singing the song so that I can pick out a song that they will be able to sing the song adequately.

I will then also search for songs that are just cheap to play short sections of because the situation that I will be filming will need to havge music playing that is somewhat recognizable.

Hi everybody,

I stumbled across this site whilst looking for something else all together and saw the topic and figured I would chime in.

I work in the licensing department of a music publisher and a good portion of my synch requests are for festival rights so I can offer some advice and links on how to make your efforts as focused as possible.

-Find the correct publisher. The publisher information is very easy to find. Ck?heck with the performing rights societies ASCAP and BMI. They will have the contact info for all publishers involved with a song. Remember that nowadays it is very common for their to be several publishers for one song, YOU WILL NEED A QUOTE FROM ALL OF THEM!
?url? http://www.ascap.com/ace/?/url?
?url? http://www.bmi.com/search/?/url?
Remember, the performing rights societies do not issue any kind of synch licenses but they have all the publisher info listed.

-Sound like you know a little bit. You are looking for a synch quote (the license comes after they send you a quote and you accept it) for film festival rights.

-Make sure you know who wrote the song; not who performed it! Often the two are not the same. It's your job to find that stuff out!

-Remember, as mentioned above you will need to clear the song and then clear the master recording of the song. The "Song" is the intellectual property made up of words/music. The master recording is the version of the song you want to use. For example, "All Along The Watch Tower" was written by Bob Dylan and there are several versions. If you want to use the Hendrix version of that song you will need to contact Bob Dylan's publisher and the record label that controls Jimi Hendrixes recordings.
Expect to pay the same for each. Most quotes for use and the subsequent license are on a Most Favored Nations Basis with any co-publishers and the Master recording. This means if you want Aerosmith's Dream on and their publisher quotes $5,000 and the master quotes $10,000 the publisher's fee will go up to be on a most favored nations basis with the master. In this example you will pay $10K a side. Do not ask for no MFN, it makes you look unprepared, inexperienced and your request then goes to the bottom of the pile. Most publishers are contractually bound to their clients to put MFN clauses in their licenses anyway.

-You are asking for a synchronization license! Yes you know that, but the people who pick up the phones have no idea why you called, be specific, we license all kinds of things from dancing stuffed bears to DVD's, tell the publisher and label you need a synch license.

-Plot synopsis and scene description. Nobody wants their song to be used in a scene where Hitler looses his virginity. That'll cost you extra and that's why we need to know the plot of the movie and the scene it;s going to be used in.

-Fees! Fee's are determined by several factors first of which are:
Use/Timing- Is it a visual vocal (character singing on-screen), background vocal (music with vocals heard in background), visual instrumental, background instrumental. That 's in order of most expensive to least expensive. Also, be sure to state how long the use is in minutes and seconds, NOT HOW THE THE SONG IS ON THE CD!!!! Yes, I see that several times a day, everyday.

-Term. How long a term are you requesting? The longer the term, the more it's going to cost. Lately everyone thinks they want perpetuity. Why? Are you going to be showing this at a film festival in 10 years? No. 18 months is on the long side for a festival use. Ask for what you really need, not the longest amount of time you can think of.

-Territory. U.S.? U.S. & Canada? Europe? Deleware only? Don't ask for the world if you aren't leaving Ohio. The bigger the territory the higher the fee. And there may be different publishers for other countries that will require even more legwork licensing.

Now we come to the meat and potatoes. Media. Are you looking for DVD rights? Film festival only? Theatrical?
The trend as of late has been for everybody and their mother to ask for "All media in perpetuity" then call up very angry when the quote is for 30 times the films total budget. Be real, you don't need that. Some of the Canadian distributors are requiring but the Canadian government also gives good amounts of money to filmmakers to offset the cost. In reality, you need Film festival, maybe DVD for North America (perpetuity is the way to go on this one, called a DVD buyout) and maybe basic cable for 5 years. That will be a hell of a lot cheaper than the ubiquitous "All media in perpetuity".

I must disagree with the above poster that thinks the publishers are waiting to screw you if your movie is a hit. It just isn't true. The fact is most likely your movie won't be a huge hit and spending tons of time negotiating broad rights and going back and forth on options that will never get exercised is a waste of the licensor's time.

Now a word on reality. Just because you want a song doesn't mean you can afford it. Top names cost huge amounts of money. Be ready for a quote of $60,000-$120,000 a side (for a total of $120,000-$240,000 once the master is added) for all media in perpetuity for a big name song.

The film festival rights are not the expensive part, I try and do ?$250-$500 (synch side only) for a year of U.S. festival rights. I think that's where the misconception comes from that after the festival if there is a buzz about your movie the publisher and label will try and screw you. It isn't that at all it;s that those other rights cost huge, huge money and film festivals do not.

Also, be realistic about your time frame. Give four to six weeks at least to get the licensing process completed. You won't see executed licenses in that time but you should be able to get a quote and have the deal finalized.

Calling everyday doesn't get your license done any faster; it pisses people off. And if you call my desk and ask if the license will be done by tomorrow I will laugh right at you and ask if you are serious.

I hope this helps, sorry I have insomnia and ramble a bit when it's late. If I can be of help post away.

I must say, some of the coolest and most creative people I work with are the independent film makers who are the festival crowd. The films are always interesting and generally the people are nice. Keep it up!

Excellent post PJD. Welcome to filmmaking.net

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The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.
Joseph Joubert, essayist (1754-1824)

One trick I used in my film was to score it with recordings made by US Military Bands. As products of the U.S. government such works can't be copyrighted so as long as the underlying music is in the public domain, you can use the recordings. DVD's of the Air Force or Marine bands can be found in many libraries. You can even download some tunes from their websites. I scored my film with Wagner, Beethoven, Sousa...all from military band CD's. Buy a DVD from my website and hear for yourself!
Dale

www.militaryintelligenceandyou.com